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German
Guns

P08 Luger
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1923
Commercial Luger Variation
Thanks
to Kyrie Ellis / Moderator - Cruffler_Forum
on Yahoo Groups for his contribution for this page ...
General
The 1923 Commercial Luger variation are those Lugers in the commercial
serial number range of approximately 73,500 to 96,000 (about 18,000 pistols).
These were pistols made in the 1920's for commercial sale in Germany and
elsewhere.
Serial number placement is in the commercial ("hidden") style.
Safeties will generally be marked "Gesichert" and extractors
"Geladen." Barrels may vary in length from 3 5/8" to 24"
or longer, and are usually chambered for the 7.65 Parabellum (.30 Luger),
but may be chambered for the 9 mm Parabellum (9 mm Luger).
Proof marks are Crown over "N" (C/N), and may be found on the
underside of the barrel, the left of the barrel extension, the left of
the breechblock, and the left of the first toggle link. The first toggle
link is generally marked with the DWM monogram, and there is the "V"
rear sight on the last toggle link.
Frames will have the stock lug, and a grip safety may be present. Longer
barrels (longer than four inches) are thought to have been installed by
local dealers rather than by DMW. These barrels may or may not be numbered
or proofed.
There is considerable variation in the 1923 Commercials. Proof marks may
or may not be where they are expected, and all proof marks may or may
not be present.
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1923Comm_L.jpg
Left side of a 1923 Commercial Luger. This specific example is
chambered for the 7.65 Parabellum, and has a six-inch barrel.
Note the C/N proof on the left of the barrel extension. Also pictured
is the end flap from a current production box of Winchester .30
Luger ammunition.
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From top to bottom, these are: 1) a round of Winchester
.30 Luger set so the cartridge headstamp can be seen, 2) a round
of Winchester .30 Luger set on its side so it can be seen as a 7.65x21
bottlenecked cartridge, and 3) a round of 7.63x25 Mauser (.30 Mauser)
ammunition. I have included the round of 7.63x25 Mauser because
people unfamiliar with either Lugers or Mauser C96 "Broomhandles"
sometimes confuse the .30 Luger and the .30 Mauser cartridges. Shooters
new to .30 Luger chambered pistols have been known to see bargain
basement prices on military surplus 7.62x25 and, thinking .30 Mauser
is just another name for .30 Luger, buy this ammunition by the case
lot to fire in their Lugers. They are disappointed to find a .30
Mauser cartridge will not chamber in a .30 Luger pistol. Shooters
new to .30 Mauser C96's sometimes make the same mistake in reverse,
and buy .30 Luger for use in their C96's. Alas, the .30 Luger cartridge
will feed and fire in a .30 Mauser C96 - frequently to the detriment
of the C96. |
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1923Comm_R.jpg
Right side of the same 1923 Commercial Luger. Note the absence of
any Imperial Army acceptance or proof marks on the barrel extension.
While the 1923 Commercial variation is usually regarded as being
of completely new, post-war manufacture, it is not rare to find
scrubbed Great War Luger parts used to assemble 1923 Commercials.
This pistol in particular is an example of this. The receiver ring
of this pistol's barrel extension shows noticeable thinning on top,
indicating something (probably a date) was removed. This removal
was done carefully, and the receiver ring shows a graceful curve. |
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1923Comm_BarrelExt_Proof.jpg
Close-up photograph of the C/N barrel extension proof. |
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1923Comm_Toggle_Proof.jpg
Close-up photograph of the "lazy" C/N proof on the first
toggle link. The breechblock is not proofed. |
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1923Comm_SN_CU.jpg
Close-up photograph of the frame serial number. The photo was taken
with the takedown lever extended into the disassembly position so
the serial number on the bottom of the takedown lever is visible.
In the commercial serial number placement, the serial numbers on
small parts were placed on the side rather than the top of parts,
to avoid visually cluttering the graceful lines of the pistol with
markings. |
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1923Comm_BBL_Marking.jpg
The six-inch barrel on this specific 1923 Commercial is not proofed,
and is marked only with the number "359." The origin and
significance of this number is unknown. While this number is not
related to the pistol's serial number, it is of the same style and
placed in the same manner as the barrel number on the 1920 Commercial
Artillery also in the author's collection. The similar number on
the 1920 Commercial Artillery does match the pistol's serial number,
providing us food for thought and (no doubt some spirited speculation).
Here is the US during the 1920's Pacific Arms was known for its
importation of Lugers to be sold commercially, and is thought to
have furnished and installed many of the longer length barrels found
on its Lugers. It is possible this is a Pacific Arms imported Luger.
Note, however, this Luger is not marked "Germany" as were
most of the Lugers made for export from Germany to the US. |
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1923Comm_Mag_Bottom.jpg
Close up of the (mismatched) wood magazine bottom on this pistol's
magazine. This appears to be the spare magazine (note the "+"
sign) to a Great War Imperial Luger, serial number 3161. It is
not known whether this magazine was originally delivered with
this Luger.
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